Living In Sydney On 70k (Is It Possible)

[jt spark]

Hi we are a family of four (kids 7 & 8) and hoping to be in Sydney by July 2013,I have been offered a 457 4 year visa to work in a role similar to what i am doing now,the starting salary starts at $70,000 plus overtime,my wife hopes to get a job also asap,we will be staying with relatives for a few months to start with,we have been to Sydney in the last year and know it's not cheap.Would appreciate any feedback from PIO,cheers.

[LCE]

I think it would be extremely hard for a family of 4 to live comfortably in Sydney on a wage of $70K, especially if you are on a 457 visa as you will have to pay school fees which I believe are around $4000 per child per year. Obviousely if it is only for the short term till your wife gets a job then you could manage, but for the long term, in my opinion it would be very hard.

[MARYROSE02]

I suppose there is a 'magic' formula for working it out. Do you know what part of the city you are going to be working? Then you can get an idea of where you can afford to live, but if you live further away to save on rent, you have to add on some more for transport costs.

 

I need $500 a week take home to live well but I don't have to pay any rent/mortgage.

 

For you, say $700 per week on rent for a decent house, maybe less, maybe more. I haven't a clue to be honest.

 

I'd say, live as close to your work as you can if you can afford it, then you won't waste too much time commuting.

 

Google 'cost of living in Sydney' and see what comes up.

[jt spark]

Thanks for getting back to us with your views on our question,we are hoping to live in Ramsgate close to family,but are flexible on this,i will have a company vehicle for getting to and from work (office is 8kms away) so hopefully this will cut down on costs,we are hoping my wife can earn around $30,000 which will help big time.

[MARYROSE02]

Company car will mean no need for you to factor in the cost of buying and running a car, although you wife may well need one. Ramsgate is a nice area but has no station which means buses. (When you said 'Ramsgate', I immediately thought 'Kent!')

 

If you search on www.domain.com.au for homes to rent/buy in Ramsgate and surrounding area, that will give you an idea of costs of a home.

 

I just Googled 'Ramsgate' and looked at the nearby suburbs with a railway station - Kogarah, Rockdale, Carlton, Bexley. I had a friend who lived at Carlton and I rather liked his home. There is no substitute for looking around the area yourself and seeing which one 'grabs' you!

[Rupert]

Hi we are a family of four (kids 7 & 8) and hoping to be in Sydney by July 2013,I have been offered a 457 4 year visa to work in a role similar to what i am doing now,the starting salary starts at $70,000 plus overtime,my wife hopes to get a job also asap,we will be staying with relatives for a few months to start with,we have been to Sydney in the last year and know it's not cheap.Would appreciate any feedback from PIO,cheers.

 

Possible - of course. Comfortable - probably not, especially on the 457 visa.

[VERYSTORMY]

What is your income now. I know that's a personal question, but it is relevant to how you are likely to cope. For example, if you currently earn £40k. You are going to find $70k very tight.

[northshorepom]

Would you live in London on about 27-30K GBP? Because I'd say that's about equivalent, given the issues with 457s ........ the school fees in particular are a killer for many and get missed

[Ellie 2]

Lots of people around Sydney live on less than $70k. What some people call "struggling" others would call living well. It's very subjective. I would say you could get by,wouldn't save much, but I haven't a clue what you consider to be a decent standard of living. I could live happily on half of $70k and still have an overseas holiday each year.

[northshorepom]

Lots of people around Sydney live on less than $70k.

 

Yes, they do, BUT most of them are entitled to some form of benefits and claiming those, plus most are not having to pay full whack for housing, nor are they losing approx $6.5K out of that per child for school fees. So it's not a very fair comparison. Life is much tougher for the new migrant on "low" pay, especially on a temporary visa and especially with dependants to support

[Ellie 2]

I don't know anything about 457 visas, but on $70k, with a family. very little tax would be deducted and I'm sure that he would not pay more rent than a PR. I just get so annoyed when people post on here that you can't live comfortably in metro Sydney unless you have well over $100k pa. It's just not true. I've been a struggling new migrant and I wouldn't really wish that on anyone but if things are a bit tight to start with you can live through it and in the end have a very good standard of living.

[northshorepom]

I don't know anything about 457 visas, but on $70k, with a family. very little tax would be deducted and I'm sure that he would not pay more rent than a PR.

 

Yes it would - that's the point. Temporary resident = no entitlement to benefits including family tax benefit. So from $70K you'd have about $15K deducted, leaving $55000. Now take off $9K in school fees for two kids, leaving $46000 which is $880 a week

 

Out of which you have to pay rent, bills, food, insurancee, clothes, travel and other incidental essentials before any consideration of luxuries. That is very tight

 

I didn't say temporary residents have to pay more rent. NEW migrants of all visa classes typically have to pay full whack for housing, be that market rents or if they are buying, mortgage costs which are very high because of 15 years of house price inflation.

 

I just get so annoyed when people post on here that you can't live comfortably in metro Sydney unless you have well over $100k pa. It's just not true. I've been a struggling new migrant and I wouldn't really wish that on anyone but if things are a bit tight to start with you can live through it and in the end have a very good standard of living.

I wouldn't say I get annoyed, but I do stick my oar in when people who have been here for ever and pay almost no rent/mortgage as a result, make out that an "average" wage like $70K is fine in somewhere as expensive as Sydney. Yeah, it might be if you're entitled to the benefits citizens/permanent residents get and don't have to pay $400pw as an absolute minimum for somewhere habitable. This is not the situation that faces new migrants, especially on 457s

[Ellie 2]

I wouldn't say I get annoyed, but I do stick my oar in when people who have been here for ever and pay almost no rent/mortgage as a result, make out that an "average" wage like $70K is fine in somewhere as expensive as Sydney. Yeah, it might be if you're entitled to the benefits citizens/permanent residents get and don't have to pay $400pw as an absolute minimum for somewhere habitable. This is not the situation that faces new migrants, especially on 457s

 

Doesn't matter how long someone has been here they still have to pay rent at the going rate or if a home owner they have to pay council rates, water rates, building insurance and put money away for repairs. The total I would think would be close to paying rent and ofcourse there could be mortgage payments on top of that. Please do not make out that those who have been here "forever" have no on going expense when putting a roof over our heads.

[LKC]

We managed on one salary of $65k, which was fine to start with, but did become more difficult as time went on (particularly in the last 18 months or so). Luckily OH has started to bring home some performance related bonuses and my business is starting to bring in a small income too. We were very lucky in that we brought a large chunk of money with us from a house/business sale, so we had a big deposit for a house (and therefore a smallish mortgage). Also, our children weren't at school to start with, so we could save gradually for the school fees (we were granted PR before youngest went to school). It is probably doable, particularly if you have the use of a company car (petrol has gone from 99c per litre to about $1.60 per litre), but I would think that you would have to have a second income to really get by.

[northshorepom]

Doesn't matter how long someone has been here they still have to pay rent at the going rate or if a home owner they have to pay council rates, water rates, building insurance and put money away for repairs. The total I would think would be close to paying rent and ofcourse there could be mortgage payments on top of that. Please do not make out that those who have been here "forever" have no on going expense when putting a roof over our heads.

 

Let's forget about people who've been here for ages who are paying rent - it's a red herring. The majority of you long termers are home owners, and the majority of you bought your homes when they cost a tiny fraction of what they cost now. Therefore if you have a mortgage at all, it's a drop in the ocean compared to what new migrants pay for their housing

 

And rates, repairs and insurances in no way add up to market rental costs - not even close. The fact that you are trying to justify otherwise (the bit I've emboldened) merely shows how out of touch you are

[Alaska]

I am normally someone who weighs in on these threads as a lot of people think you can't live in Australia unless you have well over 120k etc and I know that's rubbish, However I would think it would be tough living on $70k in Sydney because of the school fees taking a big chunk. Also you'd have to see what the schools were like in areas that you could afford on that income.

 

Don't forget that you aren't entitled to the Childcare Rebate on the 457 which effectively means that you pay double what everyone else does for childcare as PR/citizens get 50% reduction. This has meant that I (on a 457) can't afford to work as I work in educational support and it's all casual work so no guarantees anyway, and even if I could work it wouldn't really cover the childcare.

 

It is worth considering if you have a big chuck of money behind you to soak up any shortfall until you know if your wife will get work. Also for any emergencies - things are always cropping up. Also I would want to have an idea of the company's plans for sponsoring you for PR etc.

[northshorepom]

I always like LKC's posts, but I think that her response is illuminating

 

On $65K she says it was a struggle, and it was a struggle despite them not paying $9K in school fees and despite them having a small mortgage - undoubtedly less than a market rent - because they had a chunky deposit. It probably is doable, but it will be very very tight

 

And I maintain that statements about peoples' average wages have little relevance when the simple fact of being a new migrant and therefore being exposed to market housing costs, and especially being a temporary resident and not entitled to benefits and having to pay school fees, means the situations (of most people on an average wage and the OP) are completely different

[Ellie 2]

The fact that you are trying to justify otherwise (the bit I've emboldened) merely shows how out of touch you are

 

 

Not as out of touch as you assume! I do have knowledge of how expensive housing is and how much it costs to own one. We will never agree on this so just let's agree to differ.

[LKC]

I am normally someone who weighs in on these threads as a lot of people think you can't live in Australia unless you have well over 120k etc and I know that's rubbish, However I would think it would be tough living on $70k in Sydney because of the school fees taking a big chunk. Also you'd have to see what the schools were like in areas that you could afford on that income.

 

Don't forget that you aren't entitled to the Childcare Rebate on the 457 which effectively means that you pay double what everyone else does for childcare as PR/citizens get 50% reduction. This has meant that I (on a 457) can't afford to work as I work in educational support and it's all casual work so no guarantees anyway, and even if I could work it wouldn't really cover the childcare. I started my own business from home because I couldn't afford to go out to work. Both of our children were under school age when we were first here, and with two in childcare I would have been paying upwards of $160 per day just for childcare. It wasn't worth it, so I did something from home and just sent them for pre-school one/two days per week. Obviously that won't apply if your children are at school.

 

It is worth considering if you have a big chuck of money behind you to soak up any shortfall until you know if your wife will get work. Also for any emergencies - things are always cropping up. Also I would want to have an idea of the company's plans for sponsoring you for PR. We had some money behind us, and also we had it written in to OH's contract that we would be sponsored for PR as soon as we could be. Of course there is always the risk that your occupation could be taken off the necessary list before PR is achieved.

It also depends hugely on your expectations. For us, it was a calculated risk, based on the fact that after five years we will be in a better position to our position in the UK over the same period. OH has gone from owning a business in a small Suffolk town, to owning a business in a very busy and large suburb in Sydney. We knew that it would be tough for the first few years, and were willing to make the necessary sacrifices to make it work.

[LKC]

I always like LKC's posts, but I think that her response is illuminating

 

On $65K she says it was a struggle, and it was a struggle despite them not paying $9K in school fees and despite them having a small mortgage - undoubtedly less than a market rent - because they had a chunky deposit. It probably is doable, but it will be very very tight

 

And I maintain that statements about peoples' average wages have little relevance when the simple fact of being a new migrant and therefore being exposed to market housing costs, and especially being a temporary resident and not entitled to benefits and having to pay school fees, means the situations (of most people on an average wage and the OP) are completely different

 

To be fair, it wasn't a struggle for the first two or so years that we were here, but did become more of a struggle as time went on, particularly once we had decided to send the kids to pre-school and once the cost of living had started to rise. I used to be able to do a weekly shop for less than $200 including nappies, but as time has gone on that is more around the $350 mark without nappies which are pretty expensive. Then there is petrol, used to be about $70 a tank, now it is over $100 for the same car. Insurances have gone up, water and electricity bills have gone up too.

[Alaska]

There is still holiday care and breakfast club and after school care even if children are at school. The pre and after school care in our school for 2 children 5 days a week would be around $340 with no rebate!

 

We are in a similar position that you were LKC - taking a step back and thinking that it should work out better in the longer term but no guarantees especially on a 457. We are yet to see whether our calculated risk will work out but it's reassuring to read the positive stories like yours.

 

So I think that realistically you need to have a good amount of money behind you, or be sure you can pay the bills and anything extra that comes up. I think it would be impossible to only just cover things with absolutely no back up due to the fact there isn't any access to any benefits/help on this visa.

[W8ENN]

It's very expensive out here. Fuel and food is quite cheap but schooling, utillities and rent are expensive. We decided to put our 2 in a private school because $4500 per child is ridiculous for public school. We pay about $5k per year for both at a local Catholic school (I'm not Catholic but willing to give it a try for those savings haha). We've been here for 4 months and love it here, the thought of even visiting the uk sends shivers down my spine (get it, shivers, cold? Never mind ha). If my daughters play up it only takes "we'll go back to the uk" to turn them into little angels ;-) In the short time we have been here we have made some great friends and have a hectic social calendar. The key is, hunt out the bargains and you'll live cheaply. Aldi are here but same as back home you can't get everything from there. Shop around for utilities. But the main thing is get out and put yourself out and make friends, everyone I've met Aussie, Pom, NZ, Asian have all been really friendly and offered help and advice. If you need any specific advice or tips just get in touch. Good luck with the move.

[LKC]

It's very expensive out here. Fuel and food is quite cheap but schooling, utillities and rent are expensive. We decided to put our 2 in a private school because $4500 per child is ridiculous for public school. We pay about $5k per year for both at a local Catholic school (I'm not Catholic but willing to give it a try for those savings haha). We've been here for 4 months and love it here, the thought of even visiting the uk sends shivers down my spine (get it, shivers, cold? Never mind ha). If my daughters play up it only takes "we'll go back to the uk" to turn them into little angels ;-) In the short time we have been here we have made some great friends and have a hectic social calendar. The key is, hunt out the bargains and you'll live cheaply. Aldi are here but same as back home you can't get everything from there. Shop around for utilities. But the main thing is get out and put yourself out and make friends, everyone I've met Aussie, Pom, NZ, Asian have all been really friendly and offered help and advice. If you need any specific advice or tips just get in touch. Good luck with the move.

 

Our eldest daughter is funny, she absolutely refuses to believe that she might have been born somewhere else! She is 100% Australian! We have been here for a little over 4 years, and she is 6, so she has spent well over half her life here.

[Rupert]

I wouldn't say I get annoyed, but I do stick my oar in when people who have been here for ever and pay almost no rent/mortgage as a result, make out that an "average" wage like $70K is fine in somewhere as expensive as Sydney. Yeah, it might be if you're entitled to the benefits citizens/permanent residents get and don't have to pay $400pw as an absolute minimum for somewhere habitable. This is not the situation that faces new migrants, especially on 457s

 

Doesn't matter how long someone has been here they still have to pay rent at the going rate or if a home owner they have to pay council rates, water rates, building insurance and put money away for repairs. The total I would think would be close to paying rent and ofcourse there could be mortgage payments on top of that. Please do not make out that those who have been here "forever" have no on going expense when putting a roof over our heads.

 

I am truly fascinated to find out how it would be so easy to live on $70k as a new migrant. I am even more fascinated as to how you could happily live on half of that, could you actually provide some expense breakdowns to support this easy $35k a year living? Perhaps there is something you could teach us all.

 

People only say that they think it will be tight, because someone posted on here asking for opinions and that is what they think. What is there for you to get annoyed at?

 

My own rough calculations, $70k salary is $55k take home and $46k after school fees. So $880 take home per week. How do I get that to cover my expenses in metro Sydney and still have money for an overseas holiday?

Edited February 26, 2013 by Rupert

[Ellie 2]

Nobody said it would be easy for them to live on $70k: I said it was possible. If you don't believe I can do what I said $30k that's your problem as I am not a liar nor am I prepared to discuss my life on an internet forum. I can and have taken overseas holidays on less.

Edited February 26, 2013 by Ellie 2